Forum Thread

From my perspective, even if historically it was A for ally, nowadays I would say it definitely doesn't. It's way more normalized (at least in places I live and have friends in and have traveled to) for allies to attend pride and other celebrations. People try to claim A is now for ally as a means to erase sexualities, genders, etc that still aren't as accepted. I'm specifically talking about asexual, aromantic, agender, androgyny, etc. Obviously not everyone is claiming A is ally with intent to erase or harm, but there are a LOT of people who do, or insist that it is just so they can feel like they're part of a community or get some imagined special treatment that they percieve us queer people to have. It's very similar in my mind to the straight people (who are not queer in other ways) trying to come up with a flag and declare "straight pride". (Again, not saying all straight non queer people, I'm specifically talking about those who subscribe to that whole... thing)

I came out to my lil bro because he wanted to play valo on my laptop, but my account was using the bi flag so. He wasn't replying so I got nervous but turns out he was just charging his phone, then he replied "Spicy🔥🔥" then told me he ranked up my noob acc to Silver 2

@Dragonstars I feel the same way about trans people bc why is it anyone's business really? People are the most beautiful when they are happy and confident in themselves, so kudos to them. Also, people who cry about biologiccal advantages in sports had never bat an eye when it was cis people that had them 🙄

Indeed. They squeal about a woman who naturally has higher testosterone than most women participate in women's boxing and demand that she be removed, claim she is really a man in disguise, etc. and it's disgusting...

But they don't make a peep when someone is tall in basketball? So some biological advantages are okay but not others? Bleagh.

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Yup. And yet those same people who use sports and alleged advantages as an excuse to be transphobic say nothing about athletes like Michael Phelps, who literally had the perfect build to dominate in swimming, and used his MULTIPLE genetic and physical abilities to win in the Olympics, and yet people say nothing about that.

cause its more even, fundamentally yes the best body dominates sports that require physical strength.

problem is male genetics evolved for competition purposes, such is the rules of nature, whether for the attention of females or to fight off anything that could pose a threat to one's survival, females did not.

Humans are still just apes with an opinion at the end of the day, and though we have evolved rapidly and have long since not needed to be like the animals we used to be equal to, genetics don't adapt so quickly.

Which probably explains how trans people exist in the first place, and why I am indifferent to their existence, I have better things to worry about than people who are the result of genetics trying to figure out how to deal with our lack of need for animalistic genetic programming, ain't their fault, and I'm not gonna look down upon them for it, even if I am coming off as offensive, I dont intend to be, I await the day everyone stops caring so much and we can focus on much bigger problems like GETTING OFF THIS ROCK ALREADY.

Trans people exist not because of genetics, but because of society itself. Specifically western society, which developed such strict gender roles that eventually became part of so many other societies and overpowered existing cultural traditions and gender roles, is the reason trans people exist. Technically society and humans developing sentience and self awareness is what led to trans people, but more specifically it's the western world that developed bigotry and again, strict gender norms. Gender is quite literally made up, humans said "ah yes let's make this up" and now it definitely exists and has meaning, but like things like language and money, it doesn't exist in nature. You can support and be concerned about trans people and their rights while also being concerned about the fact that our planet is dying, etc etc.

gender IS made up, but the idea its western invention is stupid, eastern cultures are VERY hierarchial, with emphasis on strict societal norms and family honor and all that, everybody wanted to figure out how to best optimise the two main biological structures humanity was split into, everyone did it in their own way, and nowadays western ideas of individualism make one desire to make themselves into something they think suits them the best, even if it makes them look like a garbodor muppet.

say what you want, but some people are always gonna be repulsed, some are gonna find it lovely, and some will go "okay.

for me, its whatever....people are gonna live, I cant worry about what they do with their lives if it doesnt affect me.

though that doesnt mean I wont go against douchebags in power....I have a few issues with them

I think you misunderstand me. When I was talking about western society and how it affected gender norms in many places, I'm talking about like... centuries ago. Even millenia ago. Not modern times. There are plenty of eastern cultures who were cool with a third gender or a similar concept to trans people.

I think you do not do enough investigation into the fact that milennia ago people had less of a screw to give on all sides of the world, east or west, when the average lifespan is 40 in good times, it wasnt exactly a priority to care about people looking a little off.

regardless of cultural exchange, hell the "accepting" cultures still practice what we'd consider draconian social rules to this day, bigotry is born from a sense of freedom to do whatever you want with less and less consequences.

My personal thought is that bigotry is actually born from people who are upset that others are being their own individuals and are not exactly like them, not from people actually being their own individuals. If everyone just accepted that no two people are alike, there wouldn't be bigotry. It exists because people think their own way is the only right way for everyone to be.
that's my thoughts.

And there are plenty of examples in ancient history of things like LGBTQ+ people, people who considered themselves born in the wrong body (back then there weren't "trans" only because those treatments didn't exist, but there WERE people who felt that way), and people who did not consider themselves male or female. It's been documented for a long time; I'm no expert, but I know that much. Consider the Native American "Two Spirit" people. It's just that in our culture there are too many people who want to wear blinders and pretend that history doesn't exist, because it doesn't fit their own ideals; it's not exactly like them, so they can't be right.

Bigotry.

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Your cynicism overlooks that people that WOULD oppose it would be very unpopular back then for reasons I already said.

Ok so, I've been procrastinating the research about trans women in sports (I don't care about sports so much so I always got lazy) but since it's the topic right now I've spent a bit of time in it, I'll leave below some interesting quotes from my research and their sources

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"My strength has decreased significantly," she said. "When I first started running again after having surgery, I fell on my face a couple of times because, in my head, my legs could move that fast, but my body was telling me it couldn't. I kind of had to retrain myself."

An experience of a trans athlete after gender-affirming surgery, from CBC

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"So the question isn't 'do trans women have advantages?' - but instead, 'can trans women and women compete against one another in meaningful competition?"[...]
"Tucker: The point of the women's category is to exclude male advantage, which comes as a result of testosterone.

Until it can be shown that that advantage doesn't persist or exist in trans women, then I would say that there's no basis to allow trans women in.

The point of all that is that if there were no evidence at all, I would say that an exclusion policy would be the prudent start point.

However, we do have evidence - we have 13 studies that show significant retained advantage. We have a number of other studies of males with lower testosterone levels with prostate cancer, we know what happens with training, and so I think collectively the picture is quite strong to suggest that advantages are retained."[...]
"So for instance, World Athletics has said that once transgender women reduce testosterone for 12 months, they should be allowed in. That's not a perfect policy - nobody is saying it is - but World Athletics has said this is the best we can do with the available science.

That I think is a more reasonable approach than either saying there shouldn't be any restrictions on trans women or we shouldn't let trans women in until we know for certain."[...]
"When we separate into categories, we don't necessarily eliminate advantages, but we reduce them to the point where anyone who is in the category can enjoy meaningful competition with anyone else in the category.
What I would suggest is that it is impossible to maximise inclusion, maximise fairness, maximise safety in sport, all three of those, without some impact on the other.

If we maximise inclusion, it does come at some cost to fairness and safety. But I think that we can come up with solutions which, while they may not maximise any one of these three parameters, comes pretty close to maximising all three, and that none of these three important parameters - inclusion, safety and fairness - are overly impacted."[...]

Some of the important points made by sports scientists, interviewed by BBC

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"[...]this notion overlooks the fact that class and money are often responsible for competitive advantages in sports (i.e., access to private coaching, better facilities, better sports equipment, and specialized training)."
"Anti-trans sports bans subject all women and girls to accusations of being “too masculine” or “too good” at their sport to be a “real” woman or girl. Some require women and girls to verify their gender through sex testing, even proposing invasive and traumatic medical examinations. There’s actually a long, ugly history of this. And these tests especially harm women and girls who fall outside stereotypical notions of womanhood, who are intersex, or Black and brown, because they don’t conform to white standards of femininity."

From nwlc
Honestly? This one was my favorite to read from the three of them. Seeing the introduction with the feminism/fake feminism was convincing me to drop this one, but I'm glad I've actually read through it. There are multiple links to other very important information in the site itself, and the way it's so clear from the articles how excluding transfem athletes also makes cis athletes be targeted and oftentimes harassed for not meeting the "desired femininity standards" or whatever you'd call it. It really takes me back to so many awful comments I saw about Imane Khelif, to the point I can remember her name, even having awful memory and not caring about sports in the slightest.

You see, yes, male puberty does give physical advantages compared to how female puberty develops the body, but the topic in question is trans females in sports. Gender-affirmative care is important so a transgender person can not only "feed their individualism and look a certain desirable way", but is also an important step for integration in society, which also brings me to the topic of trans men in sports :)

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Being able to compete against other boys can be affirming and formative even before an athlete is ready to come out as trans to the rest of the world. Samuel C. didn’t transition until he was 27, but he says his experiences competing on boys’ teams as a kid in Michigan helped him feel aligned with his gender even when the world around him didn’t see him as a boy.

From insidehook. This brings a very important point and does not focus solely in elite sports, it emphasizes how sports and gender-affirmative care are important in socialization and development

Lastly, here's a list of different cultures that recognize more than two genders. Having bigger problems does not mean neglecting other's needs is necessary, as survival is not the very only thing a human is capable of pursuing and not the only of human's needs and developed abilities (although it is the most important one for sure haha).



Bigotry
stubborn and complete intolerance of any creed, belief, or opinion that differs from one's own.
Synonyms: narrow-mindedness, discrimination, bias

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To keep things simple, when I say being indifferent is good, I speak from having been smothered in both overwhelming rejection and support, its gotten frustrating that I cant be me without a big deal being made out of it, scares me off.

I just want to go out and be an average human ffs...

Quote from Windblown_Knight

I just want to go out and be an average human

That's perfectly fair.

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@windblown

stepping in for a moment!

its fine to be indifferent about things, you really dont have to defend yourself on that. eeveelover had made a great point though in that it doesnt mean you need to diminish/neglect what other people are going through and dealing with despite your own personal experiences. you can still be nice or support people while also not particularly being fully concerned yourself. during some times, especially right now in the states, its more important than ever to have a strong community full of support who can help each other in these times no matter the topic. very important to be mindful that you arent undermining others in the process of standing your ground!!

anyway, love yall <3 /p didnt even realize this was a fanclub but im happy that it is!

"I just want to go out and be an average human ffs..."

You are an average human. In my opinion it actually is a fact that every human fits first and foremost as the definition of average human before any other labels ^^
The reactions of people around you can indicate both their lack of knowledge on the subject or just their personality traits and how they think is best to react to the situation. It indicates nothing about you because you're not what people perceive you as. It does not indicate you don't fit as "average human"

This is why I think it's so important to learn from other LGBTQIA+ experiences. We have never gathered a community to feel "special" like some people like to claim, but to learn from those who go through the things we do too. My experience with connecting with other people from the community has been very positive because they all had at least basic knowledge of what is a trans person (sometimes maybe even more than I had, tbh), and instead of treating me like a big deal they just welcomed me as an average human. I'm very sorry you've had negative experiences with how people reacted to your identity/orientation but remaining indifferent to it is letting stigma and ignorance sink in. I can't deduct anything from you, but be careful and make sure this isn't affecting how you see yourself, too. As Tord said, it's alright to be indifferent if that's what you chose to, but do be mindful as it can affect others and also yourself

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Kerchow, it's my pleasure to be here. Call me Pepper or the Muse, I'm Non-binary but Genderqueer also fits the bill, up yea that's all I've got

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Welcome! ^⁠ᴗ^

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Can people share some pokemon with the same color scheme as pride flags? (shinies and emera pokemon included) I might try to draw some gijinkas for pride month
don't take this as a promise though, I might forget about it